August 4, 2017

Breaking the dependency of EU-addicts

Breaking the dependency of EU-addicts

Breaking the dependency of EU-addicts will not be easy as the EU’s tentacles have spread far and wide, but in order for the UK to swim rather than go down with the EU wreckage, that is precisely what must happen, says David Hardy.

Is there anything quite as exasperating as a die-hard Remain voter? In the light of recent IMF growth forecasts that have conspicuously failed to satisfy their gloom-laden predictions, this band of malcontents has been taking to social media to remind us all “that we haven’t actually left the EU, yet.”

Which is all rather odd because until the IMF released their figures, and without even the faintest trace of irony, these avid consumers of all things anti-Brexit had been blaming just about everything and anything on the very same Brexit they swear hasn’t yet happened!

According to the hard core anti-Brexit Guardian the UK is ‘the sick man of Europe.’ With estimated growth of 1.7 per cent predicted in 2017, if the UK is indeed ‘sick’ then heaven only knows the newspaper’s prognosis for France (1.5 per cent) and Italy (1.3 per cent). Projected German growth of 1.8 per cent hardly makes it a picture of rude health either.

Retailers such as Amazon and EasyJet announcing jobs and investment in the UK, falling unemployment, a buoyant manufacturing sector and some of the world’s largest economies lining up to strike trade deals with a post-Brexit United Kingdom, the IMF forecast merely confirms what many of us already know: Brexit is a golden opportunity, a once in a lifetime chance to forge a dynamic economy free from the shackles of the bureaucracy, inefficiency and corruption of Brussels.

Well, it could be if only it wasn’t for a group of individuals whose egos were so severely bruised that 12 months since the UK voted to leave the European super state, they still have not recovered.

“But we haven’t left the EU yet!” Infuriating as well as exasperating, Orwell himself could not have dreamed up a better example of double-think.

Ironically, it’s not the supposedly ‘uneducated’ Leave voters engaging in these outrageous acts of self-deception, rather it’s the self-styled progressives, ‘educated’ clear-thinking types such as the insufferably smug Matthew Parris who are leading the way, cherry-picking whatever fits their pro-EU agenda, slyly rejecting that which does not.

They’re sticking to their guns too: Brexit is ‘madness’ a ‘disaster’ which ‘must be stopped.’ IMF forecasts? Who needs ‘experts’ all of a sudden? Hypocritical. Arrogant. Post-factual. And, worst of all, wilfully credulous. Remainers in a nutshell.

Indeed, as I write, usually sanguine individuals are working themselves up into a lather over chlorine-washed chicken, the BBC’s latest ruse to throw a spanner in US-UK trade deals. Last week it was falling off ‘cliff-edges’, this week it’s chemical chicken. Will there ever come a day when these self-styled sophisticates don’t go off like one of Pavlov’s the moment the BBC and The Guardian press their buttons?

All of which goes to illustrate that you can hold any number of titles: PHDs, professorships and MBEs – no matter, any number of paper certificates cannot immunise against pride, egoism and sheer bloody mindedness.

The problem for Remainers is that they have dug themselves into a trench so deep, they can no longer see daylight. Whatever it takes, they must win the argument and if by doing so that entails subservience to an expansionist European superstate, then so be it. At least they will be able to say, ‘we beat Farage…’

Osborne and Cameron’s threats might have crashed and burned long ago, Soubry and Farron’s dire predictions might keep exploding in their faces compelling this duo of die-hards to keep shifting the goalposts of gloom ever further into the future, but with a fervour which can only be described as evangelical, the faithful still believe: Britain will fail. And just to ensure their prophecy does come true, Remainers have vowed to do all they can to undermine the UK’s exit from the union at every possible turn.

Just how often does Project Fear and its cheerleaders need to be proved wrong before ‘educated’ people start to view this desperate group of doom-mongers and naysayers with something even approaching circumspection?

The answer to that question is as old as the hills: self-interest and liberal doses of egoism.

For the majority of Remainers and (Leavers) Brexit never was about economics, not really. When Chancellor George Osborne made his outrageous claim that every UK family would be £4,500 worse off per year post-Brexit, working class shoppers shook their heads in disbelief. How could people compelled to do their weekly shopping in Poundland, forced to choose between eating or heating possibly get any worse off? They never even had £4,500 per year to start with!

But Osborne was not referencing Tyneside or Barrow-in-Furness. Oh no, his (erroneous) calculations were based solely on the middle classes, Waitrose shoppers, that class of people currently lamenting the difficulty of securing cheap European au pairs while keeping one eye on the cost of school fees.

Voting to Remain in the EU never did have anything to do with ‘us’ – the UK, and it most certainly did not have anything to do with the poor and the downtrodden who spend their lives combing the shelves of bargain basement supermarkets in an effort to make ends meet.

The referendum never was about ‘them’ rather it was all about ‘us’ – a relatively small corporate elite who have already decided the UK’s future path. All they had to do to succeed was to convince the credulous and the ill-informed that their fortunes and those of the EU were inextricably linked together. They didn’t fool Brexiteers, but alarmingly they did manage to hoodwink 48% of the populace.

Voting to Remain was always the ultimate act of vested interest: protecting EU subsidies for some, EU pension rights for others; it was about ensuring the continuation of EU grants and hand-outs for certain industries: universities, ‘social’ businesses, arts/community groups and a whole raft of other projects – some more dubious than others – sensed the end of the EU gravy train was nigh. And they didn’t like it one little bit.

For others still it was simply about keeping on the right side of the rich and the powerful. Politicians of all persuasions looked on with interest as failed colleagues such as the Kinnocks became millionaires courtesy of the EU. Food for thought indeed.

Personal gain or the future prosperity – economic and social – of Great Britain? For Remainers, it was a no-brainer. Money talks. And the EU has a lot of money. Thus we arrive at a situation in which vast numbers of individuals are propped up by EU cash, a habit seemingly just too difficult to kick.

Obtaining your fix though comes at a price: Acceptance of freedom of movement, dissolution of the nation state and ever closer union is, for some, a small price to pay for their dependency. What matters is the here and now. The future? For others to worry about.

Mass migration of cheap foreign labour might provide an endless supply of au-pairs, taxi drivers and fruit pickers, but it also makes the poor poorer. Tony Benn knew it. Corbyn and Galloway know it. John Mann knows it, Kate Hoey too. Cameron, Osborne, Blair and friends . . . does anyone seriously believe this trio have even superficial interest in the lives of the long term unemployed of Sunderland or South Shields?

Nothing but nothing though can shake Remainer resolve: not the incompetency, the greed, nor the breath-taking level of EU corruption and waste; not even the perilous situation of EU-induced austerity on sovereign nations like Greece. And as for Spain, Portugal and Italy . . . you guessed it, their woes are ‘despite’ not ‘because of’ the EU. Win-win.

What then of the disastrous Euro currency project? Or a state of affairs in which decisions taken in Berlin can condemn a whole generation of Greeks to effective servitude?

As thousands of migrants daily make the dangerous crossing from Africa to Europe, the EU sits impotently by. Action when it does arrive consists of bullying and threatening the Visegrad nations with draconian measures should they not take Western Europe’s path to self-destruction. Charming.

And still our intellectual superiors defend this entity. “Oh yes, it needs reform,” they will eventually concede. “It’s far from perfect . . .”

The EU project might be creaking on the point of collapse, but its adherents do not intend to let inconvenient things such as democracy stand in their way. To ensure continuation of their project, Europe’s corporate elite has craftily managed to marshal a snarling, credulous army of middle-class millennials and social justice warriors to do their bidding, a self-interested army of EU-addicts all of whom view the bloc solely through the prism of personal gain: grants, subsidies, pensions etc. etc.

Breaking this dependency will not be easy for EU tentacles have spread far and wide, but in order for the UK to swim rather than go down with the EU wreckage, that is precisely what must happen. Nobody said it would be easy, but like all addicts, once through the barrier and cured of their dependency a whole new life will open up for Remainers.

4.58 avg. rating (91% score) - 19 votes
David Hardy
David Hardy
A university lecturer by profession, David Sedgwick writes about a wide range of topics including Theatre, Politics and Formula One. His forthcoming book, ‘Shooting from the Hip’ is a collection of political essays written from a Libertarian humourist perspective. In his spare time, he enjoys marking student dissertations…
  • MrVeryAngry

    Delayed response. Aplogies.

    However as a political unicorn, who voted for JC and voted leave, I dont think the Americanised view of “someone else pays university” is a rational position. It is not ‘Americanised. It is universal. And It is entirely rational. If you can tell me where else the money comes from than from someone else then I’ll be amazed. Admittedly the government could print it, but that just devalues money held by existing savers, so again, someone else pays.

    Firstly you have to answer why if we had free HE before, why we cant have it now? Because the money has run out. It was (is) a Ponzi scheme.
    Secondly you will have to explain why it isn’t causing Brits and the poor to be pushed out of HE by foreign students and the chase for ever higher rates they usually pay. Well, actually that is exactly what is happening. Many institutions are seeking more foreign students, which in and of itself is not bad thing as it is an export.
    Thirdly explain why it wont cause Lecturers to now pay themselves ridiculous salaries and drive around in Ferraris and for universities to take on expensive projects that may end up bankrupting them. If those lecturers can add that much value then they deserve Ferraris. But they can’t so they won’t. Competition between institutions and lecturers will see to that. Unless they can achieve a ‘rent seeking opportunity’, which is what happens now where many education bureaucrats extract massive and unearned rewards.
    And lastly you’ll have to explain what he tax payer wont be bailing out the whole ponsi scheme in the next decade anyway 😉 It’s the existing scheme that is the Ponzi one. Its replacement is a free market one.

    If your argument is that more ppl go to uni now so its not the same, well more ppl live and should e paying tax too. population went up with student applications yeh and of course the number rose because ppl were encouraged to go to uni so the government could get them off the unemployed books post 2008 and also give the unit an injection of their new drug, cash! Levels of dependancy on which have risen to 10k a year lol One hell of a habit! I agree that FE was used as vehicle to mask the Blair governments employment failures.

    I want us to leave the EU and cut back on neo liberal, facist corporatism. We need a little splash of socialism. Nope. Socialism is a philosophy of moral and economic bankruptcy. It rests entirely on coercion. It denies prices and relies on rationing by self serving bureaucrats. By definition it denies property rights and therefore denies liberty. It is a foul creed. And the EU is very ‘socialist’.

    However I reserve my labour vote untill they stop this post modern, marxist based victim politics. Which of course is nothing more than “Hate the white man” no comment

    Utlimtley labour will use the same social tactics the EU is just different economic ones. Ill take the economics but not the social justice nonsense (SJ= Postmodern marxism).

    Regards. MrVA

  • Sofa Sofa

    The Americans liberated west Europe, as for the collapse of the Soviet union, that was a prime example of the destructive effect of closed borders on an economy.

    Our model is Austria not Britain

  • Sofa Sofa

    Well 4 quarters of falling property prices so far, let’s see how this affects Boris Theresa Amber Gove and Rupert Murdoch their sponsor.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Have you wondered what a reduction of population in such a scale would do to the British economy and the value of your home? Your pension?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Japan a small country? It’s a massive industrial and military power and even it felt it had to strike a free trade deal with the EU . While David Davis fantasizes about them the EU actually gets things done and signed.

  • Sofa Sofa

    You confuse the policy of Germany with that of Slovakia. We don’t let anyone in and to get a Slovak passport you need to go through hell for 8 years.

    France has many because of colonies like you guys and Germans because they don’t have kids.

    In Bratislava you see other EU citizens or American tourists we have practically no Muslims at all.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Ahem, I live in central Europe, I am in Bratislava. Yes our PM made a big fuss about that because food companies and multinationals try to game quality standards. But this is a minor issue of tweaks to the single market. The issue is not with countries, but with companies, some are Swiss some are American etc. It’s about brands like Nutella and their pricing.

    Frankly most countries would like to have that as a major political problem..
    We have a flourishing economy with rising salaries so people complain about roaming charges which shows that they regard neighbouring Austria as a model and a living standard to be reached. All while we have the euro since 2004

    If anything it shows eurozone convergence

  • Sofa Sofa

    I don’t disagree that the eurozone will not replace the USA. However the USA is abdicating active superpower status, they are isolationists and protectionist while the Trump era lasts. NATO is being dismantled by Trump. So European cooperation to spend 27 national defense budgets to contain Putin, erdogan, and the immigrants from Africa and asia Middle East.

    It’s not something that Europe designed but the vacuum that USA policies leave force us to do that and probably will force the UK to join us in that because Putin gives you the creeps even more than he does for us

    This is a choice by your cousins the USA not EU.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Paid to comment here? Seriously? If only lol!

  • Sofa Sofa

    Hang on a minute , you have a Brexit department stuffed with people who thought Margaret Thatcher was a socialist pussycat and they are going to unleash an extreme version of deregulation in pursuit of an 80es economic mirage.
    Did you hear them talk about global Britain?
    It’s kind of nutty for the EU to be accused of being the USSR and a vector of neoliberal economics at the same time.
    For the love of God that really doesn’t make sense!

    It looks too me like a national psychosis. Brexiters seem to agree on nothing beyond trying all the buttons on the cockpit of UK plc in random order.

    It’s like having pythonesque dialogue.
    To paraphrase them, what are you going to do? Bleed on us?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Can you describe for all our benefit what policies the ecj is preventing you from enacting.

    The UK is largely run by Westminster, it cannot credibly deflect blame to the EU no matter what the daily Mail would like.

    If you were in the eurozone you could have more of an argument, but if you regard your homegrown politicians as low quality, that has very little to do with the EU.

    Also very few british politicians left UK politics to go to Brussels right now, I can’t be one really. Last one was probably David Owen in 1988 or so. Who specifically did you have in mind? Only Nigel Farage works for the European parliament and he has been fiddling his expenses

  • Sofa Sofa

    What police state? You live in the country with most CCTV cameras in the world.

    North Korea is a police state. Using irrelevant terminology doesn’t convince anybody.

    Have you ever travelled around Europe? Can you give me 3 examples of police state practices?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Democracy is better than the alternatives but we have leaders that need to lead. No country improved it’s lot by committee. The example you refer to in Greece is the botched referendum of Mr Tsipras. He represents primarily the interests of pasok which was a political party that used patronage and slowly scuppered the Greek economy. 95% of what Mr Tsipras’ party consists of are people who work for the public sector and who hope to increase their salary out of general taxation when most private sector jobs in Greece are actually worse paid than the public sector.

    In short Greece is completely in the other extreme that the UK is in. It’s an almost sovietised economy by decades of too much public spending based on borrowing.

    However Greece is not representative of the eurozone or the EU. It’s exceptionally badly managed by really bad government but it is now coming round to the idea that socialism on borrowed money doesn’t work.

    In Britain the problem is the opposite, if you are an ordinary person the laws and regulations are not in your favour. Too many rewards for managers and owners and too little for working people.

    Also remember that Greece represents of 1.5% of eurozone GDP. It may have had a spectacularly botched normalisation to eurozone rules and a PM liking publicity. Economically it’s a midget, and it’s tough treatment has a lot to do with reminding Italy and France that China and India are gunning for European living standards, and that their economies need to make sense in this context.

    Anyway the eurozone is reforming several things and German tutelage is keeping the eurozone sensibly centrist.

    Capitalist but if you fall ill the system will give you a plate of food and a free hospital.

    This is better than the USA , and Britain, well I don’t know where Britain is heading
    One minute it thinks it will be a tax haven which is a business model that was not sustainable even for tiny Cyprus, the next it will be Trump’s free trade buddy although he needs protectionism.

    I admire your optimism guys but I see very little solid basis for it in fact.

  • Sofa Sofa

    From what?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Can you explain how the EU has anything to do with social justice within Britain?
    You guys are not in the Euro so the British Exchequer and government controls via taxes how much redistribution/social justice there is.

    As for the middle class spending all the way to being poor. That has everything to do with the collapse of the concept of a career and the consumeristic lifestyle as a replacement for family and love and friendship. That has everything to do with Thatcherism but little to do with the EU.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Can you quote some research showing the EU is more protectionist than e.g. mercosur?
    Last time I checked in terms of intentions the Trump administration seems to have an extremely protectionist agenda, the same country you hope to have a trade agreement with. Trump is talking about putting tariffs on everything under the sun

    How is the EU which just struck a free trade deal with Japan the most protectionist?

    You know that NAFTA is on the rocks and ttip as good as dead right?

    You relentless optimism reminds of drunk people wanting to drive although they cannot find their car…

  • Drlube

    Said the person with no self awareness coming from the most protectionist block in the world. lol

  • Drlube

    Actually the problem is the sycophants in the middle class. The same ppl that push social justice from their cosmopolitan london basements without a care in the world.

    The highest rating currency is Virtue, and the EU is stock piling it for the middle classes to spend on their way to being poor.

  • Drlube

    We’ve got enough logic to have saved your country twice no doubt.

  • Drlube

    With multiculturalism comes social justice and the rise in neo marxist post modernist politics.

    Thats why you dont have it in japan.

    And that’s all you’ve got to look forward to. In a few years you’ll see the social justice and multiculturalism will destroy any cohesion you thought you might be getting.

  • Drlube

    40 mill would be good. Give us more time and space to re build our services and get some control over whats going on.
    Still way more than Sweden, Norway, and many many other highly successful small countries have.

  • Drlube

    Funny you bring up japan. A small country that is one of theist performing countries in the world.

    They like China dont do multiculturalism because they dont need to break down their societies for political power. Which is the only reason why its done and you’re giving that power to ppl you cannot vote for.

    japan is an incredibly safe country. What’s happening in Sweden, Germany and France lol Its already looking like a 3rd world dump.

    You’re being screwed out of everything and you cannot see it.

  • Drlube

    How is it interesting? If you know anything about socialists, you will know they have to be protectionist. hence why you cannot run a socialised country on open borders.

    Open borders or high levels of immigration bankrupt public services. You know all those muslims you’re letting into your super state, they will do it. They re already doing here.
    One man has a wife, she’s not allowed to work, she has to raise 7 kids and the father drives a taxi, illegally. You give them housing, school, money and they put nothing back in. The children grow up to rinse and repeat.

    You don’t realise that your desperation to destroy and fragment societies doe not lead to economic growth, it leads to anger, resentment and collapse of your services through handouts.

    Good luck.

  • Drlube

    God you are dull, Great briton is bang on about you.

    “The foreign office has a 500 year view of the best interests of the UK. But Liam Fox thinks he knows better.”

    Are you telling me you think our government has any long term plans? I can’t stop laughing at you. Just pay attention for 5 minutes to realise the biggest issue facing the UK is short term thinking, in politics.
    Sure a downside of democracy, a problem you wont face, being that you dont have it. Only trouble is when you have a weak democracy, you open the door for much worse things. Which is being done on purpose. Hence why we’re backing away.

    “The eurozone under German conservative finance tutelage will create an economic power comparable to the USA ”

    How? The US is the worlds reserve currency and the petroleum dollar with its military might (did you forget you dont have an army) is what saved the US from total collapse in 2008.
    The world pays America. It does not pay the EU. Granted I can see you wanting this down the road but you think the US will let you? lol

    “60 million population was enough to be a nation of some stature in the world”

    Most of the countries that fill out the top 10 countries in wealth per capita, and levels of democracy are all small, democratic nations BEFORE they got sucked into the euro. If anything, the Europe will make them cumbersome, bureaucratic nightmares and their results as with all big countries or states will fall in accordance.

    “Meanwhile here in Europe a we are busy building a Noah’s ark for a world full of capitalist mega powers”

    No your building a giant target on Europe. You think a giant super state can just appear without creating disturbances in the force? Your energy being supplied by Russia, your Euro still looking shaky as hell.

    Id rather side with the US thanks.

  • Drlube

    Just an FYI, we dont have to buy chlorine chicken. And although your argument is probably more accurate, that wasn’t what the fuss was about. It was simply about “chlorine”.

    Btw how do all the eastern Eu members feel you selling them second rate food lol

  • Drlube

    Think of it this way. We’ve told the guests to leave so we can clean the house.

    Your own EU problems are a whole new mess and we haven’t finished cleaning up our own yet.
    Plus judging by the economic policies your promoting in the eu, you’re just 15 years behind us. Neo liberal economics and globalism doesn’t work. Hasn’t the US and the UK not clearly shown you this?

  • Drlube

    You’ve gone from a moaning mainlander to describing exactly why we voted leave.

    As someone pointed out to you before, our politicians use the Eu and ECJ as a shield, we’ve taken that way.
    Now our politicians have to answer to us, instead of dreaming of that life long EU job for failed, second rate, unelected or retired officials.

  • Drlube

    You can take your social justice (post modern neo marxist) drivel elsewhere.

    Social justice will bankrupt your superset and tear apart your economy quicker than you can say “why is everything now an interest group and me being white means I’m the only one who isn’t in one”.

    Enjoy that.

    P.s, here’s your social justice

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLoG9zBvvLQ

  • Drlube

    Fabulously well put Andrew.

    I just went into some rant about ungrateful EU citizens and us having to save them from the police state they are rapidly building.

    Was gonna say, they better prey we do well, otherwise who is going to save mainland Europe again? lol

  • Drlube

    Well considering we bankrupted our country twice of good working ppl and money to save Europe from the Germans, of course one would expect no sympathy or help from the bitter losers in the EU. As shown by you!

    Britain is a democracy and always will be. Your EUSSR will be fun to watch, especially when it starts war with Russia. If you think that that the EU isn’t run for Germany and an un democratic unelected elite (EU commission) then I guess history will have to repeat itself and we’ll have to come on over to the mainland and rescue you again.

    Except if we’re lucky, this time we wont bother, never got any thanks for it anyway. You do realise we brits see you as nothing. We own you, you owe us a life debt you can never pay. Its hilarious watching Germany, which has always been the problem in Europe in modern history when it comes to fighting, take over the whole of Mainland Europe without firing a singles shot. Genius really. And to watch Eu citizens worship it as some sort of bastion of modern Social justice and economics, is stunning to see. You have to be British to understand how Germans behave and their authoritative ways are coming more and more to the surface.

    In regards to your heavily biased rhetoric (as is mine), you seem to think the Eu is fine and going along nicely, which must be great. We on the other hand dont see things going so well.
    How long will the southern countries keep supporting the German economy? Not long.
    How long will countries put up wth the mass immigration and the rise in your post modern, cultural marxism, in an attempt to silence any descenders to the destruction of the idea of state? Bavaria even trying to leave lol How badly can you screw things up to get into that position? Badly!

    You simple know nothing about humans or how they behave if you have not looked into this. The Eu through multiculturalism will have to become a police state as all multicultural countries by and large are.
    Sure you could say it worked for the US but you’re not holding the petro dollar, so you can kiss that good bye. Multiculturalism will bankrupt your entire super state. Now you know why we had to leave.

    Lastly, this was all the fault of the EU. We are an island, everyone wants to come here, they dont give a crap about your EU and your dozens of languages they dont speak. Most of them speak a little english and want to come here because they think the streets are paved with gold. They aren’t and because of this demand we ask that we have special border controls which you refused. It was your stubborn insistence on open borders being integral to destroying the nation state that stopped you. Now you blame us, how typical of mainland Europeans. nothing is ever their fault.

    We told you what we needed given our special status and you got crappy and hurt feelings knowing you weren’t number one and said NON! Have you guys completely forgot we’re an island? Yes!

    As far as we can see, the EU is a dead duck or a vast un democratic police state in the making. If you cannot see that, then you know nothing about how people work.

    Maybe this 3rd time you might be lucky, you might finally destroy the UK. Until then, I’d be more respectful of the ppl that gave their lives so you can bleat and moan on here.

    Btw you can pipe down about Murdoch. If you watched the last tow elections you’ll notice social media has taken away his power and that of the Daily mail. The internet and trade would have stopped wars on the continent. All you’ve done is just join the biggest bully that keeps causing all the troubles historically for an easy ride.

    That’s just cowardice. Which is strictly an mainland European attitude.

    Good luck!

  • Drlube

    And if only you had the depth of mind to realise that’s why the Eu is the most protections block int he world.

    pssst! They’re just doing it on a bigger scale.

  • Drlube

    Yes I must say the Social Justice voice has all the politicians and big companies grovelling at their knees.

    How quickly the language of being “progressive” meant that any policy not being seen as such means we are going back in time. And that going back in time itself is defect bad.

    Ironically these SJW’s or post modern marxists (as you rightly pointed out) cannot see that their arguments based on society and economics is straight out of the the 1920’s soviet union, and 60 America.

    Not to mention the irony of progressives actually being regressive.

    Segregation you want? SJW’s want that too! Used to be called Jim Crow

  • Drlube

    I’ve always found remoaners to be the most selfish of our delightful voters.

    I have a house and a mortgage, voting Brexit was not in my immediate financial interest. Telling this to remaiers and watching them try to figure out how they can now proceed with an attack, is quite delightful.

    That’s when, to some at least, it becomes apparent they are selfish and only concerned with money. They will say “good well you voted on principles and that’s different” which in itself is an admittance that they themselves dont have any

    lol

  • Drlube

    I’ve enjoyed reading your replies as much as i enjoyed the article.

    However as a political unicorn, who voted for JC and voted leave, I dont think the Americanised view of “someone else pays university” is a rational position.

    Firstly you have to answer why if we had free HE before, why we cant have it now?
    Secondly you will have to explain why it isn’t causing Brits and the poor to be pushed out of HE by foreign students and the chase for ever higher rates they usually pay.
    Thirdly explain why it wont cause Lecturers to now pay themselves ridiculous salaries and drive around in Ferraris and for universities to take on expensive projects that may end up bankrupting them.
    And lastly you’ll have to explain what he tax payer wont be bailing out the whole ponsi scheme in the next decade anyway 😉

    If your argument is that more ppl go to uni now so its not the same, well more ppl live and should e paying tax too. population went up with student applications yeh and of course the number rose because ppl were encouraged to go to uni so the government could get them off the unemployed books post 2008 and also give the unit an injection of their new drug, cash! Levels of dependancy on which have risen to 10k a year lol One hell of a habit!

    I want us to leave the EU and cut back on neo liberal, facist corporatism. We need a little splash of socialism.

    However I reserve my labour vote untill they stop this post modern, marxist based victim politics. Which of course is nothing more than “Hate the white man”

    Utlimtley labour will use the same social tactics the EU is just different economic ones. Ill take the economics but not the social justice nonsense (SJ= Postmodern marxism).

  • Andrew Mitchell

    Sofa

    Firstly, I’m not English either, I’m Scottish, and I’m someone who actually knows a good amount about the EU because I worked in the EU fof two years, I was a Royal Marine and for two years I was part of a team that would guard the various VIPs who would attend meetings in the EU, anyway I just thought you should know that I actually know what I’m talking about regarding the EU.

    You say that the UK government has wasted money, keep in mind that its the EU that has been unable to have its own financial accounts signed off for the past 22 years on the bounce, yes all governments are wasteful but, when it comes to the EU, there truly bad, because this has happened for the past 22 years the EU gave in to the demands of MEPs and held an enquiry to find out why they fail to have their accounts signed off, a few months later the enquiry found that the main reason was inward theft, yet as always with the EU they changed absolutely nothing and sure enough, that theft continues to this very day!

    I don’t know where your getting your news re the UK economy, but if its the BBC then please don’t believe a word of it, there is a big argument brewing in the UK right now, and its because the BBC has been attacking anything and everything to do with Brexit, while being massively in favour of the UK remaining in the EU, the truth is, everything we were told before the referendum has been proven to be utterly wrong, some of the things they told us were;
    “The UK stock market would crash”, yet its performing better today than it ever has, hitting record highs.
    “The property market would crash” yet the only drop in the housing market was the month after the referendum and it dropped by 0.02%
    “All investment from outside the UK would stop”. In the month after the Brexit vote one of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world announced a new £3 billion investment into the UK, Wells Fargo Bank decided to put their European head quartets in the UK an investment of £3.7 billion, the truth is there is more investment coming into the UK this year than any previous year, even the largest German Bank, who told the British people that if we voted to leave the EU, they would move out of the UK to Paris or Frankfurt, this week announced that they will be taking an extra 500,000 square feet in their building & they extended their lease on the building an extra 25 years, so much for ” a vote to leave will mean we leave the UK”.
    We were told “that in the days after a leave vote, we would see 500,000 jobs would end, going onto 3 million in the longer term”, the UK is currently seeing record amounts of jobs, while there is less unemployed people than at anytime in our history!
    I could go on and on giving you examples of just how wrong those on the remain side have been, but to keep this short I can honestly say to you, that not one of the doom & gloom predictions the remain side said, have actually happened.

    You said that the UK has been holding back the euro, how? Just because we didn’t want the euro we haven’t stopped anyone else from having it, I don’t see how the UK can be blamed for the poor performance of a monitory system we’re not part of? Keep in mind Sofa, that when the euro was born nearly every economist on the planet said it would be a disaster, and they’ve been proven correct, it has been a disaster, just look at the worst performing countries, Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Bulgaria, what do they all have in common? Their all part of the EU and all use the euro!
    Even in 2008 when the UK was hit with the financial crash, the pound was still higher than the euro, that should tell you all you need know about the euro!

    You also mentioned ” democracy ” I find it amazing you’d have the balls to use that word in the same sentence as you use “the EU”, firstly, where and when did you vote Mr Junker into office? when did you vote the EU commissioners into office? When the people of Greece voted for their Prime Minister, the EU didn’t agree with them, they had him removed from his office and they replaced him with their guy, who just happened to be an ex Goldman Sachs employee, they did exactly the same with Italy, how is that democratic?

    We know that the EU is corrupt, its own enquiry said that was the reason for their accounts not being signed off, and we know that it is utterly undemocratic, if the people of Greece elected their PM into office, it should be them and only them, who should elect him out of office, not the EU, the only question remaining now is, why would you support a government that is undemocratic and corrupt?

    Andrew

  • Sofa Sofa

    I am not British so obviously I am not a remainer. For the record I don’t want the UK to remain in the EU. I think by leaving the UK is allowing an important reform to take place. The eurozone can get a single finance minister and become federal gradually. This under German conservative finance tutelage will create an economic power comparable to the USA. This is necessary so the euro works better as a currency during a crisis.

    The reason why the UK needs to leave is for the good of the eurozone and the gradual elimination of the EU in favour of the Eurozone. The UK would veto this so it’s good

    The UK would like to return to the past when 60 million population was enough to be a nation of some stature. This is over. Maybe the half a billion Europeans will give us the heft to cope with globalisation but it is necessary for the UK to edit the EU sobit can face it’s real problems without blaming the EU for its deadend situation in many areas full of discontent.

    We in Europe understand that we have to unite to survive the challenge of China and India as competitors gunning for our living standards.

    The UK is in a massive denial and tried to find an answer in it’s past which is a poor guide because it was a colonial power and colonisation is not available. So the artificially high living standards of the past were built of trading in new found lands with no competition and easy massive profits.

    This is why the promise of Brexit is hollow. Global Britain is a very shaky concept. But this is for Liam fox and Boris Johnson and Rupert Murdoch to work out. Certainly not an EU issue anymore.

  • Great Briton

    You’re obviously paid to comment but I’ll bite.
    EU chicken carcasses are also ridden with dirt, the very act of gutting a chicken spreads intestinal bacteria to the skin.
    The EU allows salad vegetables to be washed for the same reason.
    Don’t suppose you would allow facts to get in the way of your whiny Remainer argument. Maybe you should have read the article.
    I wonder what your financial interest is?

  • MrVeryAngry

    Social justice – weasel words. Utterly meaningless.
    Free university. That is ‘someone else pays’ university. And those paying are mostly those that don’t ‘benefit’ from university.
    It isn’t. And even if it was, so what? The rest of the stuff that is controlled by Brussels is not democratically accountable.
    Eh?

    Your are a plonker. Skilled at sophistry I grant you. But you are selective in your arguments to make points that are partial. And as it is not possible to have a constructive discussion with such devious I shall not bother with you any further. Run along now.

  • Sofa Sofa

    You know varoufakis is a self described Marxist economist and Alexis Tsipras supporter until recently, now he decided he hates him

  • Sofa Sofa

    How low do you want to take British population? 50 million? Less?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Leftwing protectionist Brexit is an interesting turn of events. But the essential idea is that EU policies are too capitalist for the UK…
    That is certainly a new one! We in the EU believe in a centrist balance , hearing that we are too capitalist for London’s tastes by PM Corbyn is I think going to justify our suspicion that we get very mixed and conflictual messages from London for a decade now…

  • Sofa Sofa

    I think the point was that the chicken carcasses disinfected with chlorine are ridden with diseases and dirt and then after a quick chlorine bath they are passed as valid chicken meat.

    Anyway soon enough you will have your sovereignty so Trump can decide your environmental and animal welfare standards.

    Bonne appetit!

  • Sofa Sofa

    The worsening of the UK debt position by order of magnitude is as follows.
    1. Reduction in GDP makes the state debt worse. That was because finance is simply not paying the taxes it used to. Nothing to do with the EU
    2.the banking crisis meant that huge uk banks had to be bailed out otherwise depositors would lose the money in their accounts creating massive panic and a renewed crisis like in 1929. The bailout money was borrowed by the government worsening the debt very significantly. Roughly comparable to that of France.

    3. New jobs created by business are largely mcjobs that mean you can’t afford to live on them. Deliveroo type jobs are a fiscal problem because they don’t pay much in tax. In continental Europe if you have a crappy job like that it is not considered a job.
    It’s not only a problem for the young. Property prices cannot remain at such high levels of you can’t pay a mortgage. This implies massive reductions in property prices in the future.

    In short if Joe Bloggs doesn’t do well, the numbers do not prosper either.

    Benefits were an attempt to reduce the disparity and it worked while the massive revenues from finance plugged that gap, at least keeping inequality from getting even more ridiculous.

    Now that finance is never going to bring in the bacon again, you need a whole new business model for UK plc…
    Who is going to do that then? Boris? Jacob Rees Mogg?

    In any case, also nothing to do with the EU.

    All the best with your future endeavours. We are neighbours and we don’t want to see bad things befall you even though you don’t want to be in our club. Besides leaving is the only way for you to realise that your problems are largely homegrown.

    Try taxing bank accounts in the isle of man, Guernsey, Jersey. You would be amazed how many trillions of pounds are there stashed.

  • Sofa Sofa

    I think most Brits want social justice, free university tuition and life chances.

    All of it is controlled by the houses of parliament, not Brussels.

    If you don’t like conservative policies don’t keep voting for the right …

  • Sofa Sofa

    We don’t want you in. This is why the EU introduced a way to leave the EU in the Lisbon treaty, and a UK citizen drafted the method to leave. I am a European not a remainer. My view is that the toxic habit of Rupert Murdoch and the daily Mail and telegraph is to blame the EU for big income disparities between British citizens. In reality they are the result of Thatcherite policies. It has created a new aristocracy of money. This has nothing to do with the EU. But because we will not convince you, it is better that you realise yourselves because you think we are your enemies

    Note though you will keep none of the benefits of the club when you leave. That doesn’t make us bad people. Just as you can’t keep going to the gym whose membership you have cancelled…

  • Dorothy Wilson

    And it was the taxes from those banking practices that funded Gordon Brown’s splurge on benefit payments. He seems to have ignored the problems that were building up so that he should increase those benefits beyond what the country could afford. When the banking crisis happened the commitment to the high level of benefits remained but the money to pay for them disappeared. And it is the aftermath of that problem that has caused our debt to increase so worryingly.

  • MrVeryAngry

    Don’t be obtuse.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Yes the remainers worry about paying a lot more tax to fund hospitals when the international banks leave and the Exchequer is out of pocket. Whereas the brexiters hope for the best regardless of disastrous harm to British tax paying businesses that will have to be made up by taxing average Joe Bloggs.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Ok so let me get this right, if your bureaucrats were born geographically closer to you and are more numerous, the bureaucracy is good value. Whereas when 27 states share one set of bureaucrats for some specific matters instead of having 27 sets of them, that is bad and inefficient.
    Interesting logic, carry on.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Guys you have embarked on a road to ruin. Just listen to how upset the Japanese are that their factories are based in the UK.

    Emotional and nationalistic delusions do not make for good budgeting.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Are you guys for real?

  • Sofa Sofa

    You realise that your private sector makes the 12 billion back in a month right? It’s like complaining about your gym membership fees when you are a professional athlete. The British government operates national debt in the trillions, inflated by a bizarre financial services industry that uses derivatives with notional value or dizzying proportions and you deal with irrelevant sums.

    Just look up how much went to save Lloyd’s tsb.

  • Sofa Sofa

    The average citizen is so lacking in mathematics as to buy things on finance and carry credit cards or buy phones in punitive monthly installments. They don’t know their arse from their elbow. This is why citizens advice bureaus exist.

    Your real enemy is your class enemies the aristocratic rich class that runs circles around you, diverting you with Farage while they foreclose on your loans.

  • Sofa Sofa

    First of all I am not British, so I don’t want you guys to stay in the EU. In fact I and many others want you out because your governments have been blocking the completion of the euro since Helmut Kohl but had useful contributions to create a single market which works fine for countries that can cope with globalisation. Now in the past the completion of the eurozone was seen as a gradual process and given Britain didn’t want the euro as a currency this changed calculations by world markets. They now see UK and London separately. You see we live in a time when 560 million Europeans may not be enough to be a big enough economic block, so Brits are very small at 60 million Englishmen.

    The global economic crisis changed a lot of assumptions that brexiters relied on massively and the funny thing is that things got spectacularly worse for their case.
    It revealed a lot of the shiny financial industry in London and New York to be smoke and mirrors and the profits not to be real or at least not sustainable.
    The British government sort of admitted the shambles when it nationalised collapsing ancient banks like Lloyd’s along with Alexis Tsipras nationalising his banks.

    In the cold light of day the continentals don’t look at Britain as a model anymore because a lot of the tax revenues that existed before are now gone for good because they were based on crazy risks. So the UK simply wasn’t anywhere near as successful as it pretends to be under Tony Blair, there’s a lot of money missing. These modest circumstances should have generated pragmatists to look at ways Britain would reindustrialise and rebalance it’s economy by making things. However that is proving very hard. So the jobs didn’t go to the polish plumber as Farage would have you think, they were never created because you bet the shop on finance, and it failed miserably to deliver on jobs, and Brexit will aggravate that even more as much business will now be forced to relocate. Again Farage injured the country he claims to love so much and crucially the tax revenues that pay for your local hospital. So this affects you very much, it’s not idle political talk.

    Then all this necessary cost cutting to cope with reduced circumstances and balance the books after the billions of tax revenues that will never come back made Britons themselves not like the jobs created in their own country by the private sector. Without major industries some of Thatcherism’s central tenets have been shown to be claptrap. Losing British industry and focusing on finance was a Thatcher decision and was an unmitigated disaster that only reveals itself fully now because it caused the reliance on casino financial services that produce disappointing tax revenues and now are deserting Britain very easily because they are fickle. After all you can do trading in cheaper locations than London with its Ponzi real estate market.

    These are awesome problems with no obvious solutions. One key detail the loss of jobs in finance has as much to do with automation allowing an American bank based in London to serve Europe to relocate labour to e.g. Bratislava and keep financiers in Berlin or Frankfurt. They save money.

    As for the Murdochian argument that the EU doesn’t like how money is used in the EU budget.
    The EU budget money gets recycled back into EU states. It represents a puny 1% of EU GDP. Although numerically it sounds impressive, so do the bills to decommission 1 nuclear power plant in rural parts of the UK. All government is wasteful, very wasteful, and it is state bureaucrats losing the money. Largely because despite everything it has always been so.

    Just look at how much money the Exchequer had to borrow to save northern rock in the UK. The EU budget is a rounding error by comparison. Also the money comes from all 27 states and goes to the poorest regions.

    Before the EU the British budget was handing money out to Wales and Scotland and now you are hiring British bureaucrats to do it all over again. If you don’t then parts of the UK will depopulate creating much more harm.

    In any case I am not here to convince you to stay. Good luck with everything. We want you to leave because you guys have a paranoid spinster mentality and a victim syndrome.

    Beware of the dreams of Rupert Murdoch and the daily mail. They supported the destruction of British imdustry, god knows what it is going to be directed at next. The creative industries?

  • Andrew Mitchell

    Sofa sofa, do you know that the EU has been unable to have its own financial accounts signed off, for not one year, not two, not even ten years but for the past 22 years on the bounce, the EU was forced to hold an enquiry into why they couldn’t get their accounts signed off, that enquiry found that the reason was down to theft from within, in other words those in the EU were stealing the money, our money! To date they have changed absolutely nothing, they simply ignore it, so from this we know that the EU is corrupt, when you add that the EU forced out the elected government of Greece to put their own people in, that makes it undemocratic, so why would anyone, want to be part of something that is corrupt and undemocratic? When you add the fact that to date, 7 countries have held referendum on adopting things like the Lisbon treaty, these 7 countries voted No to the treaty yet the EU either ignored the vote or as in the case of Ireland, told them to vote again until they gave the answer the EU wanted, again utterly undemocratic. I will give the EU one thing though, I love the fact that Barnier and the EU are threatening the UK, they think that may make the people think again about wanting out, their right it will, but when they threaten the people of this country, their doing it to the wrong people, the British don’t take threats too well, its the main reason we saved their arses so many times, not only will the majority react badly to their threats but, it proves just how week the EU really is, after all coming out with “the EU is so good, and you will do so bad without us, that we’re going to threaten you because you want to leave?” If it was that good, why would they use threats to keep people in?

  • bob

    Maybe not but what the ordinary man in the street does do is common sense, something which is sadly lacking in our political establishment.

  • evad666

    Was Kids Company in receipt of EU monies?

  • evad666

    Has anyone got a copy of ” And the weak suffer what they must? by Yanis Varoufakis to give to the old fool Vince Cable?

  • MrVeryAngry

    That comes automatically with re-establishing our borders.

  • MrVeryAngry

    Indeed. But to get what I want, and lots of other people want, you have to start with getting out of the EU. Post March 19 we can then really set about bloated prodnosing government and especially the unaccountable quango state. At the moment the Powers That Be use the EU as a shield,
    .

  • Sofa Sofa

    There is nothing more Marxist than closing borders because you can’t cope with capitalist competition from the EU.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Did you get any of these things. How pleased are you with the department of Brexit and the vast layers of bureaucracy planned hiring public servants like nuts with massive salaries and pensions in a hurry strike you ?

  • Sofa Sofa

    Another observation is that much of the analysis about the downtrodden sounds quite Marxist, but then I don’t understand why you believe the remedy being Brexit and ultra right wing anti worker policies by someone like Jacob Rees Mogg will improve their lot. The obvious target should be your aristocracy, the EU has nothing to do with it.

  • Sofa Sofa

    Let’s be honest. It’s not going well.. I find this wild enthusiasm for Brexit slightly amusing. In any case rest assured that we in Europe want to see you continue your path towards your utopia which is economically libertarian and protectionist at the same time. To me that is wildly conflictual. But you guys don’t do logic anymore.

  • Helen Smith

    I was surprised the article didn’t point this out, I keep having this argument with my remain sisters, they bang on about losing EU grants, I say there is no such thing, it’s our money.

  • Helen Smith

    Getting our fishing waters back too

  • Helen Smith

    Before the ref I said to my eldest son that if Remain won Leavers would never get over it because for them it was all about sovereignty, whereas if Leave won the economy would be fine so within 6 months Remain supporters would have come round, since for them it was all about money.

    I never thought for one moment that Remainers would be so blinkered, that being ‘right’ would mean more to them than their country, and having demonised Leavers as racist and thick to comfort themselves they would find themselves in the position of having to stop Brexit because it’s undoubted success would prove them wrong, again.

  • ethanedwards2002

    At last. Finally someone in the media who gets it. Great article.

  • mike_in_brum

    Immigration from the EU is the worst thing that ever happened to Britain! Just kick them all out of the country!

  • ratcatcher11

    The BBC’s chlorine in chicken row lasted just long enough for the population to be informed that Britain has had chlorine in it’s drinking water for a century or more and as the gastric juices are hydrochloric acid it is unlikely to cause us any harm. The ignorant oiks at the BBC had not bargained that an educated section of the public would counter argue against its propaganda so effectively. But then they also forgot just how many in society are university educated and look on these ill-educated broadcasters with some disdain.

  • Dorothy Wilson

    “it was about ensuring the continuation of EU grants and hand-outs for certain industries: universities, ‘social’ businesses, arts/community groups and a whole raft of other projects – some more dubious than others – sensed the end of the EU gravy train was nigh.”

    Someone should remain these people that the ultimate source of the grants and hands out they receive is the UK taxpayer The money comes from the £4.4bn the EU deigns to hand back to us from the £12bn or so we have to hand over each year.

  • Malcolm

    The real difference in my experience between those hard core Remainers and most committed Leavers is put quite simply: Self-interest versus the National-interest.

  • Muttley

    Having had “discussions” with a number of foam-flecked Remainers, their main problem is that they lack imagination. They can only see a choice between the culturally marxist EU or a return to 1950s Britain. (Mind you, given the sclerotic and self-destructive state of the EU, even a return to 1950s Britain would be preferable because at least we would still be free.) But this Manichean mindset amongst Remainers and their inability to move on are preventing them from forming a positive vision of post-Brexit Britain or even taking part in the debate, beyond demanding the staus quo by any means. Worse, their negativity could damage the Brexit process, to the advantage of no-one.

  • MrVeryAngry

    Thank you.

  • DEvans

    A nice reply and seconded without reservation.

  • DEvans

    A good read, many thanks.

  • MrVeryAngry

    Nice piece. For me Brexit was all about Liberty, democratic accountability, the Rule of Law, real free trade and the first step in killing off the crony corporatist, bureaucratic, morally and financially bankrupt, quango regulationist state.

  • Denial_a_river_in_Islington

    So, Corbyn gets it, as did Benn. And yet, he’ll do everything in his power to derail it at the cost of the Government for his own personal political gain! This is how we come to end up with a different Labour Party policy for every constituency, according to it’s alignment. Bespoke Brexit! For the one, not the many………..

x
We’re committed to providing a free platform to host insightful commentary from across the political spectrum. To help us expand our readership, and to show your support, please like our Facebook page: